your views requested on trading with renko bars

[sumitalwar]

hello

for a while i have been thinking of using renko bars.

i tried a renko bar afl on amibroker with reasonably good data source . but it showed weird presentation of price.

i even tried range bars in amibroker but they had some practicality issues .

so i discussed with few of online friends .

predominantly two issues came

1) nt7 would be better for renko bars instead of amibroker . as amibroker is not suitable to plot renko --- in this situation nt7 along with gdfl data shud solve the purpose .

2) renko bars need data from esignal for them to be plotted properly . which approximately cost almost 150 usd per month ( currently out of budget ).

i would definitely want to give them a try after my current data expires in a month or so .

1) would like to know the views of the members of the esteemed forum for their experience of renko bars ( who have tried them ) . including the data vendor they used and the charting pf they used .

2) is the premise correct that amibroker is unsuitable for renko bars

3 ) any shortcomings of using renko bars .

4 ) optimum brick size of renko for nf and bnf

5) is the perception correct that renko needs esignal type data ( tick data what is called in common parlance )


rgds


sumit

 

[mt4trader]

Amibroker not suitable for renko bars.the way it plots the charts different from ninjatrader.
ninjatrader good for all types of bars. it support many types bars no other software supports.
DATA i am not tried gfdl, i heard they giving data in one mnt form.
ninja trader requires tick data for renko bars. now data available from
echartpro databull charts2win all same.
backfill data will not work with renko charts.we have keep always on the system for saving tick data.
esignal provide tick data backfill but expensive.
in ninjatrader many varieties of renko are available best are unirenko or ntrenko.

 

[sumitalwar]

hello


any more user of renko bars do share the experience

 

[Iron_Man]

hello


any more user of renko bars do share the experience

Before you use it, you have to understand what RENKO Bar is. Only visual will tempt you but you have to be realistic.

Normal Bar - It takes price and time into consideration. So a bar is formed when price makes OHLC in a particular time frame. The moment TF is over, the bar changes and therefore OHLC changes.

Renko Bar - Keeps only tick into consideration. No time consideration. So you have to set how many ticks u define as down and how many ticks you define as up. eg. Lets say you keep 100 ticks as base for upbar. Now no matter wheter market goes up or down, till 100 ticks, your bar will show green (and vice versa for downbar)

Heikin Ashi does somewhat similar thing. Only difference is in Heikin Ashi, time factor is considered.

Now as far as which platform can plot this... is concerned, it can be done on Ami as well as ninja. What you must have is accurate tick based chart which is costly and not easily supplied by Indian providers and that is why you were recommended to have eSignal

 

[NJ23]

AmiBroker can plot it even with 1 min snapshot data feed(GDFL Feed) but renko bars will change when you change the base TF of your chart. Ex: You plot renko bars with a bar size of your choice on a 1 min tf and if you change tf of the same chart, bars will change.

 

[sumitalwar]

Before you use it, you have to understand what RENKO Bar is. Only visual will tempt you but you have to be realistic.

Normal Bar - It takes price and time into consideration. So a bar is formed when price makes OHLC in a particular time frame. The moment TF is over, the bar changes and therefore OHLC changes.

Renko Bar - Keeps only tick into consideration. No time consideration. So you have to set how many ticks u define as down and how many ticks you define as up. eg. Lets say you keep 100 ticks as base for upbar. Now no matter wheter market goes up or down, till 100 ticks, your bar will show green (and vice versa for downbar)

Heikin Ashi does somewhat similar thing. Only difference is in Heikin Ashi, time factor is considered.

Now as far as which platform can plot this... is concerned, it can be done on Ami as well as ninja. What you must have is accurate tick based chart which is costly and not easily supplied by Indian providers and that is why you were recommended to have eSignal

thanks for the reply. i understand its core concept . yet to have ample experience of it what looks visually appealing can be applied in real time or not .


best rgds

 

[boarders]

AmiBroker can plot it even with 1 min snapshot data feed(GDFL Feed) but renko bars will change when you change the base TF of your chart. Ex: You plot renko bars with a bar size of your choice on a 1 min tf and if you change tf of the same chart, bars will change.

first of all, one must understand that the concept of renko bars and point and figure bars does not have time factor and will plot correctly ONLY if tick Tf is used, therefore just forget using it on any timeframe other than tick. if we use it on other timeframe the plot will be wrong altogether and therefore your trading decisions based on such charts will also be wrong. thus any data feed other than based on tick cannot be used (like GFDL which is based on 1 minute).
the cheapest and acceptable way is to extract data from your trading terminal
and feed to amibroker and keep the time frame compulsorily on tick. you can try Josh utility which is available for free in this forum.
once you have this setup and then analyze such charts, decide the boxsize on a scrip to scip basis, and apply appropriate price action, you will never ever again trade with any other method.

 

[sumitalwar]

first of all, one must understand that the concept of renko bars and point and figure bars does not have time factor and will plot correctly ONLY if tick Tf is used, therefore just forget using it on any timeframe other than tick. if we use it on other timeframe the plot will be wrong altogether and therefore your trading decisions based on such charts will also be wrong. thus any data feed other than based on tick cannot be used (like GFDL which is based on 1 minute).
the cheapest and acceptable way is to extract data from your trading terminal
and feed to amibroker and keep the time frame compulsorily on tick. you can try Josh utility which is available for free in this forum.
once you have this setup and then analyze such charts, decide the boxsize on a scrip to scip basis, and apply appropriate price action, you will never ever again trade with any other method.

thanks boarders. there is an issue w.r.t terminal data in the event there is a disconnection with net the backfill isnt tick .

secondly is ami competent to plot renko bars becuase few of my coder friends told me that nt7 is a better choice for plotting renko and ami is not competent enough for the job

rgds

 

[boarders]

the backfill you get is mostly minimum 1 minute data which is enough if tick data cannot be procured (especially when using extracted data from trading terminal). this data although is in 1 minute, it will contain all the major lows and highs required for plotting support and resistances. This data will miss the price variations between the minutes, thats all. but considering that it is free, it is well worth.

but remember that you must always keep the chart always on TICK mode only even though using 1 minute backfill data for missing data.

I myself am using amibroker and Point and figure charts for trading (P&F cuts out more of the noise than renko and is similar in plotting method) (earlier used renko before P&F)
and not facing any issue. NT does have more ways of plotting renko, but data feed could be an issue. I being proficient enough with AFL code am comfortable with ami.
All the best.

 

[boarders]

I am trading intraday for last 10 years and have tried all sorts of paid data services and various afl indicators.

finally I found my holy grail in renko and P&F and now use only P&F with price action in trading. mthe trick is to find the right box size and reversal values which are unique to each scrip. the higher these values is equivalent to using higher time frames in normal charts. for example a trader may look at 30 minute chart to determine long term trend and trade a 5 minute chart in the direction of 30 minute chart. The same is achieved in renko and p&f system by using a 100 renko boxsize chart to determine direction and trade a 25 box chart in direction of 100 box chart ( although this is not required as the 25 box chaqrt itself will show you trend direction without looking at 100 box chart).

I have used many different paid services and finally settlke for data extraction from trading terminal. The best of the paid service I used was of GDFL. The main issue I faced with their feed is that although the data is tick their minimum base TF is of 1 minute therefore you cannot select Tick mode chart to display. Also their data goes and corrects the data many times backwards after the RT event meaning many a times you will find the low or high of a previously formed candle suddenly changes value (repaints) and thus suddenly you will find that you are into a trade where you shoudnt be into.

the difference between 1 minute backfill data ( or 1 minute realtime data) and 1 minute timeframe chart. I feel many are confused with this subject.

- 1 minute backfill data means the OHLC values of data at the beginning or end every minute. (this data is enough for backfill as this data is after the event has happened and is used for only analysis of future course of action)

- in the case of realtime 1 minute data, means that you get data updation only once every minute and between the updation there is a silence period of 59 seconds and all the events happening during this period of 59 seconds will not be updated until the next pulse at which time you get the OHLC during that silence period in one shot. (this can be a additional noise filter, but on the other hand in case of a wide range bar, you could be put in a fix, like a cat drinking milk with shut eyes )
- most trading terminals for retail trading gives you 1 to 5 second updations. as a retail trader I find this acceptable, considering its free.
- in the case of a chart with one minute timeframe, the chart will allow to advance a candle only at the end of one minute. therefore if you keep a renko or P&F chart on a 1 or any other time frame other than tick, even if renko wants to paint a new candle, the 1 minute tf you set will not allow it to paint that candle as teh chart will wait for the running minute to end, thus that renko candle or candles forming in between mintes will go missing, this is why when you look at renko chart with different time frames you see big variation in the plots and does not show you the real thing and so cant be traded. THis is why that renko and P&F must always be in tick mode charts.