Fire your tax related queries and i would get it solved!!!

Are you able to understand the replies and act accordingly to this thread ??

  • Yes, able to understand BUT NOT able to take suggested course

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Somewhat able to take desicions, BUT seek professional help in my area

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Find it tough to understand the replies hence always seek other professional help

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Not able to understand any of the replies !!!

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    4
  • Poll closed .
Hi,
I have made a loss of 15k in option trading this fiscal year ended March. Reading the posts I have understood that this income falls under business income. I just wanted to know whether this loss that i have made can be set against my salary.

Thanks!

Btw this is an excellent thread! Keep up the good work!:clap:
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Thanks but can u please tell me ...i am preparing my cash book so tht my uncle who is my CA told me that it will b easier for him to make entries in tally
now main issue is what
1)i have kept one account as for my trading ..savings act and transfter funds for trading through another savings acount.
2)problem is what is my capital ..is it the funds i have transferred to the trading acount tht is capital or the funds in the personal account through which i transfer funds tht also comes as my capital.
3)How do u treat open positions in my options as on 31st march...he told me something about openieng stock but i wanted to know what is the logic of that?
4)I am not getting how come my main personal savings acount money gets treatment as business money only?
pls help me i know about accounts just i wanted to know for my knowledge what are the things.
Ques 1 & 2....

See if i ask you how much money you have with you then your reply would naturally would be the total of amount which you have in all of your pockets and not only that in your wallet !!!

Similarly any money which is the seed capital be it in any account which is for trading or which is not for trading is your capital. for simple understanding.

You started your trading with Rs.10 transferred to your broker out of your personal savings account which HAD a balance of Rs. 30. therefore what you did was transfer from one pocket to another but the money's worth or your capital was always Rs. 30.

Now on that Rs. 10 transferred you earned 5 as profit so now your total capital is Rs. 35 BUT you pay tax on Rs. 5 because that is what you earned.

Actually i believe you are in desperate need of any accountant. It would not be practical or possible for me to teach such accounting entries here.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Thanks :) So I can claim the full value of fuel (diesel) bills but not the cost of batteries for the inverter, which have to be replaced every 4 years? The IT department would certainly demand all the fuel purchase receipts but the petrol pumps generally do not give receipts here. :eek: I guess I have to demand receipts from them every time.
If your inverter batteries last 4 years then it needs to be capitalized otherwise they can be expensed off also. And yes do keep the petrol pump receipts or fill it using the credit cards then it gets reflected automatically.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Hi diosys,

There are certain aspects to the filing of income from equities that seem ambiguous to me..please clarify if you find the time.I'm sure all or most of it has already been answered.I had gone through a lot of old pages here, sometime ago and had found many answers there. I don't remember most of it now though .I dread having to go through all of it again...so... :confused:

1) Is business income same as speculative income? What does income from day trading fall under?

2)I can trade and invest using the same account..but maintain separate books for both,thereby paying capital gains as well as tax on business income(or is it speculative income?), for transactions on the same account , right?

3)Definition of trading is open to interpretation , right? I presume that intra day transactions definitely fall under trading. What about BTST then? A stock bought in BTST is mostly bought with the intent of trading ( but can't it be used with the intent to cut losses in case of drastic decline in price from the very moment of purchase, even when you're open to holding onto the position for long term barring very steep drop in prices and dramatic change in business outlook (like in the case of RNRL immediately after the judgment),which would not be possible with a non btst purchase...or does investment mean holding onto your losses no matter how steep the fall in price.Now, I must add that all of this is not likely to happen in the little extra time that BTST buys..but still. It's more likely that I don't really understand investment :D

4)Again, how can intent to trade be established? Can a stock not be bought with the intent to invest..but be sold in a few days' time due to unforeseen external factors. Say...a stock were purchased with a target of 30% appreciation in price in a time frame of an year..but due to unforeseen positive developments, in a week's time, if the stock were to meet the target, and hence if it were to be sold,would this count as trading? How can intent even be established objectively? Are there any objective guidelines at all, that may be used as a reference point for this purpose - even if they are not binding on anyone?

5)Would the assessing officer be bound by any guidelines for scenarios such as the aforementioned?

6)Do accounts with turnover greater than 40 lakhs need auditing? Or is it only if the turnover from trading is greater than 40 lakhs? If the turnover from transactions resulting in capital gains is greater than 40 lakhs, then would no auditing be required? I'm somewhat aware of the allowances made for F&O transactions,but they don't apply to me currently at least.

7)In case of the final tally for all transactions in an year resulting in loss, day trading as well as investment, is it still mandatory for this loss to be declared
while filing tax or is it needed only if the losses need to be carried forward?

8) Is day trading income added to salary to arrive at tax rates for income?

That's a lot of questions...but it's tax-filing time and I haven't the slightest clue what goes where..and the customer care folks etc at online-filing portals seem to know no better.

Please try to clarify if possible...thanks!
GOD HELPS THEM WHO HELP THEMSELVES (though i do not mean to be god myself)...... ;)

Anyways. in very short i would answer since all the queries are already answered.

1.) NO . 1a) Business Income (speculative is cash day trading).
2.) YES but prone to litigation.
3.) YES.
4.) REALLY NO ONE HAS AN ANSWER TO THIS !!!
5.) YES, though the guidelines are very very subjective.
6.) YES AUDIT if business income turnover is greater than Rs. 40 lacs not capital.
7.) YES, Loss in business loss is carried forwarded separately.
8.) YES
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
respected sir
i am doing mcx future trading in my huf account i get some profit around 1 lakh last year.my ca told me that i required audit of my account because cost of trading material crosses the 40 lakh limit please suggest me what is the rule
Yes, he is correct.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Sir, I have a question. A senior Citizen over 70 years of age invested 15 lacs in approved
bank in Senior Citizen Saving Scheme 2004 in March 2010.
Can one avail deduction of One lac under Sec 80 C with above deposit for the Assesment Year 2010-11.Regards MKH
confirm with the bank that the said scheme was covered under 80C or not.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Hi Diosys

Firstly, thanks for the reply.

It is a business loss and this is the first year of trading in F&O segment.

Do i still need to maintain books of accounts in the given case.

In case i need to maintain books of accounts then how should the sales & purchases be shown. can it be shown net i.e. sales-purchase and then show the other expenses separately.

If not then in which section of the ITR-4 should the same be disclosed.

Thanks in advance
Regards
Floyd
You would require to maintain books since claiming loss in the future year would be tough without production of books (if required). Once your books are prepared then all the subsequent queries can be addressed.

For detailed entry guide there is another thread in this sub forum which does a good job in guiding. Refer to it.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
SIR Can NSDL charges (which the bse and nse both applies on every sell of shares in respective exchange)be deducted from STCG of shares?

I have a STCG of Approximate 12k but i see NSDL charges being applied upto 200 buks on my account after every sell of shares...
NSDL charges of Rs. 200 after every sell ???

Seems strange. Anyways before commenting i would need to know the exact nature of these charges. hence get hold of your broker and confirm that for what these charges have been levied.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Dear Diosys,

Thanks for your reply. Just wanted to clarify the following:

2 & 3.The trust will be assessed as individual i.e will its income have basic exemption and taxed at rates of individual or will have direct 30% tax as in companies.

Will this Trust have to be registered somewhere.Is there a draft available for such trust?

What will be the tax implications once this trust is closed and amount transferred to children as per todays law.

Regards
Indu
They would be taxable at 30%.

You would need to get it drafted by a civil lawyer.

Amounts on closing the trust would be non taxable since tax has already been paid on profits earned.
 

diosys

Well-Known Member
Re: Tax query regarding company fixed deposits

Hi,

I have opened a company deposit in financial year 2009-2010(compound reinvestment option). But the company did not send me any interest certificate of accrued interest
since I submitted a 15G form.

But is there any accepted procedure to calculate the accrued interest prescribed by
the IT department so that I can calculate it myself.

Thanks
No there is not. You can calculate it yourself.
 

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