Going with the Intraday Mini-Flow!!

[Prabhjeet]

Neeraj plz. avoid using caps, your post is sounding too loud man

 

[arvind296]

Dear Saint Sir,
This is my first message on your any thread although I regularly visit both 60 min and this thread. since last 4-5 years I am trading stocks, option and futures but was never able to earn profit consistently. since last year and half I have read over 25 book on trading and TA. but I was not able to apply that knowledge when it comes to real trading. It's only When I gone through your thread Teach a man ------, that I was able to understand the importance of psychology, risk management, importance of simple trading method. I would be always greatful to you for teaching TA in such simple manner.
also I am currently paper trading this day trading method and also 60 minute pivot method. I might start real trading in next few days.
I generally never post any messages but i could not resist to write this message as I learned so much from you. please keep posting. my good wishes to you.
God bless you
Regards
Arvind

 

[rakeshluthra430]

We are trading 30 min bar here,and where did you get 15 min TF ? Saint has talked about 20 min to be used in exceptional case such as pivots on 30 not very clearly visible,a long tail formed in 30, a very steep reverse move and 30 pivot not in site etc.In all normal circumstances we look at 30 only.Dont look at 15 every now and then.

Smart_trade

Hi All,
This system looks really simple and effective, though did trade it live only today. Though most of the times..the markets make it very clear as to when to look at the 20 min charts as Smart had rightly pointed out, but I have a doubt....

Lets look at the 30 min chart of 26 Sep, till about 11:30...there is no pivot on the 30...trend is clearly down, with stops at days high. Now, when we look at the 15 min charts...it gives us a clear pivot at 4081. So....we lower our overall stops to this level+7.

Now..in the next few bars...the 15 min attempts to break this high, but misses it by a few points. However,when we look at the 30...it doesnt seem as if the trend has changed to up. (I have attached both charts and pointed out a hypothetical situation). Would it have been right to go long on the 30 min charts (if 15 min ph was broken)....without it having made/broken any pivots on the 30min?

One more question ..what is our defence against these false moves on lower tfs than 30? And if we have to take these moves..as part of the plan, then how come we are effectively trading the 30 min charts? When I went though this, to me it seemed as if I am trading the 15 min with 30 as perspective, and not the other way around.

Guess I am seriously missing out something....some key link that I am not able to comprehend clearly. Kindly help to resolve this dilemma.

Thanks a lot,
Rakesh
ps: Tried using 20min instead of 15, no change in my dilemma.

 

[vvvv]

Hi All,
This system looks really simple and effective, though did trade it live only today. Though most of the times..the markets make it very clear as to when to look at the 20 min charts as Smart had rightly pointed out, but I have a doubt....

Lets look at the 30 min chart of 26 Sep, till about 11:30...there is no pivot on the 30...trend is clearly down, with stops at days high. Now, when we look at the 15 min charts...it gives us a clear pivot at 4081. So....we lower our overall stops to this level+7.

Now..in the next few bars...the 15 min attempts to break this high, but misses it by a few points. However,when we look at the 30...it doesnt seem as if the trend has changed to up. (I have attached both charts and pointed out a hypothetical situation). Would it have been right to go long on the 30 min charts (if 15 min ph was broken)....without it having made/broken any pivots on the 30min?

One more question ..what is our defence against these false moves on lower tfs than 30? And if we have to take these moves..as part of the plan, then how come we are effectively trading the 30 min charts? When I went though this, to me it seemed as if I am trading the 15 min with 30 as perspective, and not the other way around.

Guess I am seriously missing out something....some key link that I am not able to comprehend clearly. Kindly help to resolve this dilemma.

Thanks a lot,
Rakesh
ps: Tried using 20min instead of 15, no change in my dilemma.

tht is not a pivot on the 15 min by definition...if it luks like a pivot to u then ur pivot definition will be sumthing else.
now,saint says to go by the eye....my eye still identifies pivots as per definition.
now the eye identifies a pivot kind of thingie which is not a pivot by definition.
point to note is how imp is tht thingie with context to the present scenario.
for this u need loads of experience & a trained eye which saint possesses.
to me it is a kind of speculation bcos my eyes are not yet trained to tht level.hence i go by the definition of a pivot very strictly.

 

[Saint]

Hi All,
This system looks really simple and effective, though did trade it live only today. Though most of the times..the markets make it very clear as to when to look at the 20 min charts as Smart had rightly pointed out, but I have a doubt....

Lets look at the 30 min chart of 26 Sep, till about 11:30...there is no pivot on the 30...trend is clearly down, with stops at days high. Now, when we look at the 15 min charts...it gives us a clear pivot at 4081. So....we lower our overall stops to this level+7.

Now..in the next few bars...the 15 min attempts to break this high, but misses it by a few points. However,when we look at the 30...it doesnt seem as if the trend has changed to up. (I have attached both charts and pointed out a hypothetical situation). Would it have been right to go long on the 30 min charts (if 15 min ph was broken)....without it having made/broken any pivots on the 30min?

One more question ..what is our defence against these false moves on lower tfs than 30? And if we have to take these moves..as part of the plan, then how come we are effectively trading the 30 min charts? When I went though this, to me it seemed as if I am trading the 15 min with 30 as perspective, and not the other way around.

Guess I am seriously missing out something....some key link that I am not able to comprehend clearly. Kindly help to resolve this dilemma.

Thanks a lot,
Rakesh
ps: Tried using 20min instead of 15, no change in my dilemma.

Rakesh,

You are trading the 30min charts.........successive lower highs and lower lows till 11:30 am as pointed out by yourself.Stops still where they are,at the first bar high +room.....Then we have a pivot high formed at 4083,and a fall.Only then are stops brought down to the high of that pivot + room.And again at the next pivot.

We are NOT trading the 15/20min charts........we seek the help of the 15/20 when we get vertical bars with no pivots......we seek the help of the 60 for an overall viewpoint and for some key candle reversals.Other than that,it's only 30min all the way.

And No Rakesh........a pivot break on the 15 does not in itself give you a reversal......

Saint

 

[Saint]

Be careful of our over-enthusiastic attempts to trail stop and get ourselves stopped out and reverse in all the wrong places..........These overzealous attempts to protect profits curbs the Flow of things.

Take some off the table and allow the rest to go with the Flow.

At the end,when reversals happen,we might have left a bit on the table.......our attempts to take the last penny in every move can sometimes lead to great problems.

Move Stops up/down with Pivots on the 30.........like today,we had no pivots,we are going to seek the help of the 20min charts to help us out.

Once again:Careful on an overzealous attempt at protecting profits and getting yourself in 5 trades on a day when there probably was only one.


Saint

 

[orderflow13]

Once again:Careful on an overzealous attempt at protecting profits and getting yourself in 5 trades on a day when there probably was only one.


Saint

what a point ... when trading 60 min flow ..all came up with 30 min.. now when we trading 30 min... they come up with 15 .. lol.. i was wondering are we heading for 15 min flow with 5 min in picture .... shorter the time frame we getting whipsawed out + brokerage
P.S. I really liked the idea visual pivots as vikram pointed out ... plz forgive me saint sir.. but i really against of mechanical trading .. n ppl try to make it as a formula and try to make it as black box ... black boxes didnt work in the history of 100 years .. you have to rely on ur experience at the end of the day

 

[ratan jain]

Be careful of our over-enthusiastic attempts to trail stop and get ourselves stopped out and reverse in all the wrong places..........These overzealous attempts to protect profits curbs the Flow of things.

Take some off the table and allow the rest to go with the Flow.

At the end,when reversals happen,we might have left a bit on the table.......our attempts to take the last penny in every move can sometimes lead to great problems.

Move Stops up/down with Pivots on the 30.........like today,we had no pivots,we are going to seek the help of the 20min charts to help us out.

Once again:Careful on an overzealous attempt at protecting profits and getting yourself in 5 trades on a day when there probably was only one.


Saint

Oh God! Pivots on 30?
I thought that once we enter, we are looking to move SAR based on pivots on the 15......

Can you please clarify Sir?

 

[novice1]

Is there a add coming up at 3985+filter ?

Thanks

 

[Smart_trade]

Oh God! Pivots on 30?
I thought that once we enter, we are looking to move SAR based on pivots on the 15......

Can you please clarify Sir?

We always traded pivots on 30 in this thread.15 or 20 only if pivot on 30 not very well visible. I find that there is a tendency to abandon 30 and shift to 15 immediately to have small stoplosses and early reversals.But you have to pay the price by way of false starts,more trades,more brokerages and above all more hectic trading.

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade