Going with the Intraday Mini-Flow!!

[ratan jain]

Another huge fluctuation day was 2nd july 08.. wow! It would have tested our discipline to the max,a nd am sure most of us here would have made a loss, though the system ultimately gave a profit that day

Inputs to this would be welcome

 

[alokdaga]

Saint,

Please allow me to share my views here. I am not in favour of too many tweaks as overoptimisation kills the efficiency and robustness of the system.Also in fast markets the system has to be very simple to understand as we have to take our trades,adds,profit booking etc and how many things are we going to monitor ?Pivots,WRB,Pivots on 20/15,bars with long tails,4 up/down bars,2 bars high/low,now new candlestick patterns and something else ......

I would prefer to consider the system in present form (which is doing pretty well...so lets not fix something unless it is broken) as a broader canvass which Saint has provided and everyone can have his choice of the brush and colours to be used to complete a beautiful painting at the end of the day....

Thanks, was sharing my views only ....

But still a tweak or two to improve profitability is most welcome,and who says I am not greedy ?.....

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade

Truly agree with you. Simpler the system is - lesser the confusion and more are the chances of right execution !

 

[Saint]

Could anyone analyse 4th of june 08 based on this system?

According to me there are quite a few stops and reversals, and if I or anyone here could understand that one day, a lot of questions about stop and reverse could be answered for everyone here. It would be a perfect example of how to go from long to short to long and such things.

Also, it would also confirm my understanding about the system..
Also, would the 12pm bar be called 4 bearish bars ina row, prompting us to mover stops and not sar to the high of two bars back?

And yes, call me dumb, but a reiteration wont hurt.. when do we drop down to 15 mis for pivots? when we feel that a pivot is almost formed on 30 but not visible on 30 so we drop to 15?

Hi Ratan,

You are far from dumb,my friend........your phrasing of the question itself removes al possibility of that.

Great question as always.

Bit of a Saturday Blues.......a bit lazy to put up a chart.But will guide you bar by bar and tell you what I am seeing and what is simultaneously going through my mind.

10:00 AM:Bar 1 has formed......H 4713,L 4681

10:15 AM:Previous bar's high was taken out.....new High of 4716.80.But our filter keeps us out of the trade.Note:Although not that clear on the 30,more evident on the 15/20 is that price made an attempt at going to new highs and failed at breaking past our filter.This was Move 1.

10:45 AM:Move 2 happens......the lows are taken out.4681-7=4674 our entry price.Stop loss at 4717 + 7=4724

11:00 AM:All going to plan.

11:30 AM:?Bottoming Tails ......Switch over to 15min charts,not for any action,just to clearly see what is happening.Okay,we have a tiny bullish candle.......nothing to write home about.Let's see how the next candle on the 30 behaves.

12:00 noon:Another down move,another bearish candle on the 30.........now that mini bull candle on the 15 assumes great significance.I have me a small pivot.Now,guard is up,all attention on how the next candle behaves.Using the 4 bar rule,my stop is at 4686+7=4693.But that comes in if we don't have any pivots at all,even on the 15 .......here we have a pivot high of 4669.Reversal stands at 4669+7=4676

12:15 PM:The pivot highs are taken out......we are now Long.Note that we did not add to our previous position.Reason is did not get a pivot on the 15 or 30,no wide range bar as well.Anyway,we are long now on our intial position.

12:30 PM:The previous candle was a high volume wide range bar,now excited to add to positions.ADD 1 over the prev candle's high on the 15.viz 4687 +5=4692

12:45 PM:We had a multiple bar move down on the 30 to bring our attention to the 15 for greater clarity.Now we have this great big wide range candle on the 30........to observe what is happening within that candle,we are back at looking at the 15min charts.So we have a mini bearish candle......no problem,2 big candles on high volume on the 15,one big candle on the 30,well,price taking a mini-break....nothing to worry.

1:00 PM:Hmm.....another minor bullish candle on the 15...now we have ourselves a pivot on the 15 again,and a hanging man on the 30.....as said before,it's a coming together of all time frames.When there is conflict between the time frames,take the 30 as that is the principal timeframe.When all in unison,react accordingly.Stop loss to pivot low on the 15 and the low of the hanging man on the 30........4677-7=4670

1:30 PM:Short reversal triggerred......4670

1:45 PM:ADD 1 triggerred at 4640(previous pivot low)-5=4635

3:30pm:Exit all by close......roughly 4580.

Hope it's clearer now,Ratan......get back to me if something needs more clarity.

Saint

 

[Saint]

Truly agree with you. Simpler the system is - lesser the confusion and more are the chances of right execution !

Always.....

Saint

 

[Smart_trade]

Great explanation Saint, it is better than the chart.It gives your thought process bar by bar which is most important in understanding the actions ...

Smart_trade

 

[Saint]

Saint,

Please allow me to share my views here. I am not in favour of too many tweaks as overoptimisation kills the efficiency and robustness of the system.Also in fast markets the system has to be very simple to understand as we have to take our trades,adds,profit booking etc and how many things are we going to monitor ?Pivots,WRB,Pivots on 20/15,bars with long tails,4 up/down bars,2 bars high/low,now new candlestick patterns and something else ......

I would prefer to consider the system in present form (which is doing pretty well...so lets not fix something unless it is broken) as a broader canvass which Saint has provided and everyone can have his choice of the brush and colours to be used to complete a beautiful painting at the end of the day....

Thanks, was sharing my views only ....

But still a tweak or two to improve profitability is most welcome,and who says I am not greedy ?.....

Best Wishes,

Smart_trade

All in the present form only...... but a mastery,in fact,just a brief understanding of candlesticks can come in handy,especially if it turns up on the 60min charts.

That if any is the only thing required as a tweak.........

Thanx Smart Trade,as always.

Saint

 

[ratan jain]

Hi Ratan,

You are far from dumb,my friend........your phrasing of the question itself removes al possibility of that.

Great question as always.

Bit of a Saturday Blues.......a bit lazy to put up a chart.But will guide you bar by bar and tell you what I am seeing and what is simultaneously going through my mind.

10:00 AM:Bar 1 has formed......H 4713,L 4681

10:15 AM:Previous bar's high was taken out.....new High of 4716.80.But our filter keeps us out of the trade.Note:Although not that clear on the 30,more evident on the 15/20 is that price made an attempt at going to new highs and failed at breaking past our filter.This was Move 1.

10:45 AM:Move 2 happens......the lows are taken out.4681-7=4674 our entry price.Stop loss at 4717 + 7=4724

11:00 AM:All going to plan.

11:30 AM:?Bottoming Tails ......Switch over to 15min charts,not for any action,just to clearly see what is happening.Okay,we have a tiny bullish candle.......nothing to write home about.Let's see how the next candle on the 30 behaves.

12:00 noon:Another down move,another bearish candle on the 30.........now that mini bull candle on the 15 assumes great significance.I have me a small pivot.Now,guard is up,all attention on how the next candle behaves.Using the 4 bar rule,my stop is at 4686+7=4693.But that comes in if we don't have any pivots at all,even on the 15 .......here we have a pivot high of 4669.Reversal stands at 4669+7=4676

12:15 PM:The pivot highs are taken out......we are now Long.Note that we did not add to our previous position.Reason is did not get a pivot on the 15 or 30,no wide range bar as well.Anyway,we are long now on our intial position.

12:30 PM:The previous candle was a high volume wide range bar,now excited to add to positions.ADD 1 over the prev candle's high on the 15.viz 4687 +5=4692

12:45 PM:We had a multiple bar move down on the 30 to bring our attention to the 15 for greater clarity.Now we have this great big wide range candle on the 30........to observe what is happening within that candle,we are back at looking at the 15min charts.So we have a mini bearish candle......no problem,2 big candles on high volume on the 15,one big candle on the 30,well,price taking a mini-break....nothing to worry.

1:00 PM:Hmm.....another minor bullish candle on the 15...now we have ourselves a pivot on the 15 again,and a hanging man on the 30.....as said before,it's a coming together of all time frames.When there is conflict between the time frames,take the 30 as that is the principal timeframe.When all in unison,react accordingly.Stop loss to pivot low on the 15 and the low of the hanging man on the 30........4677-7=4670

1:30 PM:Short reversal triggerred......4670

1:45 PM:ADD 1 triggerred at 4640(previous pivot low)-5=4635

3:30pm:Exit all by close......roughly 4580.

Hope it's clearer now,Ratan......get back to me if something needs more clarity.

Saint

THANKS THANKS THANKS!!!!

Really appreciate the trouble you have taken, Sir.

I will go through your post and get back

Thanks again!

 

[musicjunkie]

it's sometimes scary to see everyone thinking the same thoughts.......got up today,wanted to tweak using candlestick patterns and a few others.........and voila,there already is a post here from yourself before i could even say anything.

saint

I'm sure you will come up with something before market open on Monday Saint.

MJ-

 

[beethoven]

Can someone please put up the relevant chart (June 4)!!!! This detailed reply by Saint is too important to let go without fully studying. Thanks
Beethoven

 

[sikandar]

Hi Ratan,

You are far from dumb,my friend........your phrasing of the question itself removes al possibility of that.

Great question as always.

Bit of a Saturday Blues.......a bit lazy to put up a chart.But will guide you bar by bar and tell you what I am seeing and what is simultaneously going through my mind.

10:00 AM:Bar 1 has formed......H 4713,L 4681


Saint

Offcorse the question was ratans but the reply by saint is for all of us Thank you saint as always
sikandar