A plunge in Indian Stock market

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
Have come across the same situation many a times. I feel that one should use the observation to gauge the emotions of traders. Its best interpreted from candle sticks.

Hey Moonlite.. i do feel candlesticks is a very very good way to modulate /decide and make trades..

But for me , as i enter the trade..i am not able to see the candlesticks..i only watch the price..so it may happen that Price may go against me in that spur of the moment and i hit my out...but on a 2 min candle stick is is still a bullish move after 2 mins is over..

I am just scalping..i think if i can start using Candlesticks..the decisions can be more rational..or is it vice versa?
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
A Blog from http://traderfeed.blogspot.in/:

As I look across the good trading and not-so-good trading that I've observed over the years--my own, as well as that of others--there are two big mistakes that stand out as key differentiators:

1) Putting Prediction Ahead of Understanding - In a sense, this boils down to acting before we truly understand the rationale for action. At first blush this makes no sense at all. Still, the fear of missing moves and the need to make money sometimes lead us to anticipate market behavior before we've fully done the work of understanding why markets should move in such a fashion. Traders often speak about the importance of having confidence in their views. Genuine conviction, I find, is a function of deep understanding. If we perceive that we have a grasp of what is driving markets, we are more likely to stick with the trade ideas emanating from that understanding. Nothing guarantees, of course, that our explanations of market behavior are correct. It's a pretty good guarantee, however, that if we anticipate market movement and put on positions before we achieve a grasp of why that movement should occur, we'll be easily shaken from our ungrounded convictions.

In the chart above, I track what I call "Demand" for stocks. It is a running five-day average of upticks vs. downticks among NYSE shares. There is some predictive value to those data, but particularly important from my vantage point is putting the data into context to understand what is happening in markets. When markets move quickly from a point of negative Demand--net selling pressure--to a point of high Demand (net buying pressure), that momentum reflects an important shift in market participation that tends to persist over the near term. Conversely, when markets bounce higher but net Demand remains negative, that suggests a lack of upside participation and, ultimately, a vulnerability to the rise. Note how that was the case during the market topping in September. One important component of understanding is simply identifying whether buyers or sellers are in control of the market and which way that balance is moving. Identical chart patterns can follow from very different configurations of net Demand.

2) Mismatch of Time Horizons - This is the result of conceptualizing trade ideas on one time horizon and managing the risk on a very different time frame. A classic example would be a "macro" trader who develops a fundamental thesis about how stocks should move over the next 3-6 months, but then is forced to stop out of positions on retracements that, ultimately, are expectable over such a time period. In other words, the psychological tolerance for loss is poorly matched with the trader's conceptual framework. This occurs at trading firms where risk is managed tightly, but where traders still feel a need to stick with ideas and maintain their convictions. I recall working with a rookie daytrader whose hit rate on trades was startlingly abysmal. It seemed as though the results were not random, but represented a significant negative alpha. What that trader would do is set stops insanely close to the point of entry, pride himself on a "good risk-reward trade" and then get stopped out 80% of the time on a putative 3:1 good bet.

When the press for opportunity greatly exceeds the tolerance for loss, it's a sure bet that good trades will be managed poorly. We can have superior market understanding, derive excellent trade ideas from that understanding, and still fail to make money simply because we our psychological misalignment between risk and reward leads to poorly aligned position management. Far better to stay in good trades with modest size than continually stop oneself out on noise and fail to capitalize on solid understanding.
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
Hii. First time i heard about Stoploss Hunting...But i tried to look into google and it was described in multiple sites..

I got some idea..but still not very clear..

I am assuming Stoploss hunting can be done by a big Bank/player (Seller) in an Upside break out situation. But when the upside momentum is already too high why he would take a risk of making stock fall ...There could be another big buyer there who can trump him...

Or is it that he is acting on both sides of the trade...Shorting at Top and then getting long at Stoloss Hunting level..?
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
I was getting over confident as i was able to close Green occasionally and today was the day when market corrected me and told that you cannot be over confident on anything..But be humble that Iam (Market) is giving you some money..

The start was a normal trade..i lost 250 and exited..I was confident that i can make it back easily..

But the Next trade i was Long into BHEL..it was already up..and it was consolidating...I just entered into it long, suspecting that it will be in range for some time and then break up...as normally happens 60-70%..

But the Market began started behaving weirdly..and started dragging the stock down...I averaged at a lower price ..thinking that it will pull up...But not..i had to hit out...Negative 1400..

I then thought of looking it for some more time and then trading it back..
But it was all choppy and i could only hit out..

I made a few good trades as well..in ITC..i made around Rs 1000 in a trade...but then i entered ONGC...it was down a lot and had started recovering a bit..i LONGed it and it was showing a good profit of 500...but i had to head for office so i kept a Stoploss...eventually when i checked it the profit had vanished and it had hit the stop loss..

Stocks Traded: ITC , BHEL , ONGC
P&L : RED 1900 after commissions


It seems that just like Stocks , Human also follow a graph..3-4 days up in a row and then a correction...

How was the general feeling about Market today with the other Traders??
 
It was a good session for me.....shorted HDFC and earned 10 points....later, tried to short M&M but level didnt come.....
I could have shorted JindalSteel & JswSteel but wanted to play safe as i had a losing session friday after 3-4 winning days just like u had today.....
I learnt that small SL are must and play for small profits and believe in your own set-ups/tipgiver friends etc.
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
It was a good session for me.....shorted HDFC and earned 10 points....later, tried to short M&M but level didnt come.....
I could have shorted JindalSteel & JswSteel but wanted to play safe as i had a losing session friday after 3-4 winning days just like u had today.....
I learnt that small SL are must and play for small profits and believe in your own set-ups/tipgiver friends etc.
Thats Nice Sammy...
You are very correct about having small SL...but on the other side...i usually donot book profits if is not more than 100..and that way many times i turn them into Red and then book it..

Some one told me that Let your Profits run..I think that is what remains in my mind...But now i think that having a Trailing Stop/Breakeven Stop is better than to get out in Loss.
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
It was a good session for me.....shorted HDFC and earned 10 points....later, tried to short M&M but level didnt come.....
I could have shorted JindalSteel & JswSteel but wanted to play safe as i had a losing session friday after 3-4 winning days just like u had today.....
I learnt that small SL are must and play for small profits and believe in your own set-ups/tipgiver friends etc.
HI Sammy..what criteria do you use to enter trade..I saw u had written M&M level didn't come..is it support & resistance level?
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
Today was a normal day for me..Due to my loss yesterday , i was defensive today.
I took few positions and after watching the stocks..I think that we get to work on our discipline only when we lose money to market..

But anyways i traded 3 stocks today , but i did feel that market was moving up and down..and untill we are in good stock, money making was difficult today..

Stocks Traded: Tata Steel , BHEL , ONGC
P&L : Green 608 after commissions.

I also noticed one more thing about my behaviour..i tend to play aggressive if i am in loss...
But when i am in profit..i let go even some simple trades where money could have been made easily..

I guess senior Traders here would vouch that they may be more aggressive when in Profits and not vice versa?
 
I sometimes follow tips by few followers on FB....apart from that, now a days NR7 is on my mind....
Today i long AshokLeyland which gave me 1100 loss.....played LT...overall 500 RED....chalta hai, i will earn tomorrow......less than 999 doesnt hit my mind hard no matter its P or L.
For tomorrow, i have Bajaj Auto in my mind as its in NR21...lets see how it goes.happy trading
 

sspms2002

Well-Known Member
I sometimes follow tips by few followers on FB....apart from that, now a days NR7 is on my mind....
Hey Sammy...I like your confidence...for me i am not selecting any stock in particular..but i do watch 5-6 of my pet stocks..

I also looked at LT , it makes good movement..but i think i have not graduated to play a little more volatile stocks having slippage..

Also i just heard about NR4/NR21 for the first time...I am just googling to find out more..
 

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