Forex Journey from $500 real acct...

[AdaG]

Ok...Lemme say something here....I,myself have worked with ICICI as the Interbank FX trader.And to tell you really, the order book is just a facade. Even if you trade with the best ECN/Bank with highest liquidity, the volume data is still questionable because of the OTC nature of the market. Millions...Yes millions of dollars are traded without ever getting listed in the order books.
IMHO...volume data is just not entirely reliable. While, you can use it to a great extent, you cant rely on it for a trading system.

Ok...could you tell which tools were you using to get the market depth. If you have to deploy 50-60mio in a day quickly how would you know what kind of a liquidity is present in the market. If the price drifts when you buy because there is no liquidity then the customer will not be very happy will he. Remember you are a dealer not a trader and no dealer workes based on the technical analysis. They make money following order flow which get represented on the charts later. If you dont care about these things some day other bank who does will take your business. I guess no bank in India works as such so no issues here, but world is more competitive than you know. There are prime brokerages which are connected to most of the major banks around the world....just imagine you are a clearing house of top 6 out of 10 banks and many big hedge funds and bucket shops around the world. If you have a dealing desk what kind of quotes you are getting.

I have seen spreadsheet trading which contains all these info so I know. Obviously no one can cover the whole market but it is not required. You know HSBC deals most of the forex trades for HK and singapore. Same Citi used to do for China before '08 and Bear stearns for US, UK. Lets say you know at 3rd quarter end China is unloading inventory and HSBC is going to do it, if you are clearing house for HSBC one day during Euro session your panel shows 1-5 mio size trades at multiple position by HSBC what does that mean.....

 

[ag_fx]

I have seen spreadsheet trading which contains all these info so I know. Obviously no one can cover the whole market but it is not required. You know HSBC deals most of the forex trades for HK and singapore. Same Citi used to do for China before '08 and Bear stearns for US, UK. Lets say you know at 3rd quarter end China is unloading inventory and HSBC is going to do it, if you are clearing house for HSBC one day during Euro session your panel shows 1-5 mio size trades at multiple position by HSBC what does that mean.....

That was my whole point. YOU CANT COVER THE WHOLE MARKET. If you want to draw inferences and trade on the data from top of the pyramid, you certainly can and you could make money too. But, in the essence, my whole point is, there is no STANDARD VOLUME DATA that you can rely upon. If you need it or not is totally a different thing. It depends on what kind of trading system that you use.

And your whole post of how dealing desks works is entirely out of the context here. What you said is true, but yes, out of context of having a RELIABLE VOLUME INDICATOR. And we are here talking of traders..not dealers' operations..are we?

No Hard feelings buddy. If you still want to know what tools did we/I use, go ahead and PM me.I'll be glad to have discussions with a man who seems well informed. :thumb:

 

[ag_fx]

T
So, is the volume reliable? To some extent it is, there are people who trade exclusively using VSA on fx and are successful.

The entire premise of VSA is based on the fact that what market participants are doing. They place high emphasis on the EXACT price quote and the volume thereon. Now, on OTC market, leave out the question of EXACT price quote, there is always a difference of a pip or half amongst various brokers. While, it might not matter that much because it is too small, but it is definitely not the same.
And again leave out the premise of exact Volume. We all agree we cant have that.

So what are you left with? Some bits of broken VSA premises on which you trade and make money. There is nothing wrong in it and I am in no way against any such study. So dont get me wrong.

My argument is only this: There is no EXACT or confirmed Volume data available. You can trade on bits of information that you have got....But you cant call it complete.

Best :thumb:
Ankit

 

[pipshower]

MT4 platform has lot of indicators and Expert Advisors. Does OANDA has any better tools ? I am using a OANDA demo account, but did not find any supporting indicators. Please clarify.

u know what vijbala....u just told what i was gonna say!
really i feel lil rusty about oanda's platform....
i was thinking to use something else!
so expert advices are most welcomed....please!!!

Well Ankit has already answered the questions of yours..
Almost everyone in forex world provide you with free MT4 ..You can download it and start practicing..
About oanda they use Java based platform , though they have basic charting tools to use its not a problem , what most of traders using oanda do is use the MT4 from other broker and use oanda for trading actual orders..It doesnt matter ..

 

[pipshower]

Thank you Pipshower,
The realized profit shows 597 $. Is it an automated trading?
Please share with us the secret of making profit from FX market

Its not Automated trading .
I trade manually.
I guess you know the secret of making money in Fx market ---everyone knowS...LOL
But knowing is different from doing..thats why many fail..

 

[pipshower]

Well the profits do look lucrative.......but I would not recommend anyone using 32:1 leverage.

Post # 5: Position value 26734$ against a 844$ account. Or in same post margin used is 534$ => 534*50 = around 26K position. So true leverage is around 26700/844 = around 32 times account size. No professional uses that much leverage. Use proper money management.

exactly...
not only it has potential to wipe out ur whole money..but u may have to pay from ur another accounts too....
so beware..

"A good money management with not so good trading strategy is far better than poor money management with the best trading strategy"
:annoyed:

Very well said traderone and sushant,
You both are right on it..Money management is key to long term success in FX or any market in world ..
No doubt about that..
But FIRST OF ALL I AM NOT PROFESSIONAL TRADER !

Second thing this is test acct to indicate a journey from $500 ..You can read the first post of thread where i said dont ask abt trading method and position size LOL!
My main acct is bigger and MM is strictly ?? followed there ..

I know you guys are professional traders out here making tons of cash evry month ..Please keep doing so and guiding newbies like me to help them make cash each day..


NOTE: I AM TRADING RISK FREE ON THIS ACCT SINCE THE $500 I DEPOSITED TO START THIS ACCTS HAS BEEN WITHDRAWN ALREADY WITH MORE PROFITS TOO..NOW LETS PLAY WITH MARKET MONEY!:clap:

 

[vicky_ag]

The entire premise of VSA is based on the fact that what market participants are doing. They place high emphasis on the EXACT price quote and the volume thereon. Now, on OTC market, leave out the question of EXACT price quote, there is always a difference of a pip or half amongst various brokers. While, it might not matter that much because it is too small, but it is definitely not the same.
And again leave out the premise of exact Volume. We all agree we cant have that.

So what are you left with? Some bits of broken VSA premises on which you trade and make money. There is nothing wrong in it and I am in no way against any such study. So dont get me wrong.

My argument is only this: There is no EXACT or confirmed Volume data available. You can trade on bits of information that you have got....But you cant call it complete.

Best :thumb:
Ankit

Is there an emphasis on the exact price? Thats new for me. I thought it was abt the close in comparison to the high and low plus the volume. And pip or 2 diff in close as compared , remember compared, doesnt matter a zilch. So, that solves first part on VSA.

The volume part as I pointed out is abt sampling. Yes, there are no central exchanges to collate and provide the exact up and down activites. But sure individual brokers volumes are enough as representation.

I can sum my point with this saying "Boond Boond se hi samandar bharta hain".

 

[AdaG]

That was my whole point. YOU CANT COVER THE WHOLE MARKET. If you want to draw inferences and trade on the data from top of the pyramid, you certainly can and you could make money too. But, in the essence, my whole point is, there is no STANDARD VOLUME DATA that you can rely upon. If you need it or not is totally a different thing. It depends on what kind of trading system that you use.

And your whole post of how dealing desks works is entirely out of the context here. What you said is true, but yes, out of context of having a RELIABLE VOLUME INDICATOR. And we are here talking of traders..not dealers' operations..are we?

No Hard feelings buddy. If you still want to know what tools did we/I use, go ahead and PM me.I'll be glad to have discussions with a man who seems well informed. :thumb:

Ok....lets imagine there is a core system (like Reuter or HP server) which conduct all of the forex transactions and could provide real time volume data. Are you sure you will make profit from it. There are tons of methods of manipulating data and pro traders know that. In the stock market you have volume but how many traders use it in their analysis. I see none in the forums of traderji.

We trade to make profits not to become perfect traders. Why do you think you need to know the whole market, if the flow is one way just swim along. Unlike bonds and IPOs, dealers' operations is important in this market because its regular and sets the majority of moves....a latest example year end book building is going on and Euro/GBP is down because of home currency movement and profit booking by big banks. Big orders set big moves.

I have already wrote that what you are saying is true so no hard feelings at all Ankit.....just I have some time these days to write and explain things here.

Happy holidays!

 

[pipshower]

Ok....lets imagine there is a core system (like Reuter or HP server) which conduct all of the forex transactions and could provide real time volume data. Are you sure you will make profit from it. There are tons of methods of manipulating data and pro traders know that. In the stock market you have volume but how many traders use it in their analysis. I see none in the forums of traderji.

We trade to make profits not to become perfect traders. Why do you think you need to know the whole market, if the flow is one way just swim along. Unlike bonds and IPOs, dealers' operations is important in this market because its regular and sets the majority of moves....a latest example year end book building is going on and Euro/GBP is down because of home currency movement and profit booking by big banks. Big orders set big moves.

I have already wrote that what you are saying is true so no hard feelings at all Ankit.....just I have some time these days to write and explain things here.

Happy holidays!

Hello Adag and Ankit,
You both are right in one way or other ..
As Adag said the orderflow trading is pure form of price trading ..Thats what is reflected in charts ...Level 2 data and orderbooks on banks hint us for the right entry ..going with the flow...Is the key to long term success ...Either create the flow yourself [IF YOU HAVE ENOUGH CASH --U R A BIG BOY!] Or follow the flow..

For those who want to really trade based on volume ?the real one which means the orderflow look for orderbooks on bank level 2 feeds ...

Well Adag and Ankit i would like you both to post this data you have put with pros and cons of orderflow trading which is actual term than the volume trading for that in more detail..A better thing would be continue this discussion further..
One who has access to order flow with his experience and charts can make a hell lot of money for sure!:thumb:

 

[vicky_ag]

Hello Adag and Ankit,
You both are right in one way or other ..
As Adag said the orderflow trading is pure form of price trading ..Thats what is reflected in charts ...Level 2 data and orderbooks on banks hint us for the right entry ..going with the flow...Is the key to long term success ...Either create the flow yourself [IF YOU HAVE ENOUGH CASH --U R A BIG BOY!] Or follow the flow..

For those who want to really trade based on volume ?the real one which means the orderflow look for orderbooks on bank level 2 feeds ...

Well Adag and Ankit i would like you both to post this data you have put with pros and cons of orderflow trading which is actual term than the volume trading for that in more detail..A better thing would be continue this discussion further..
One who has access to order flow with his experience and charts can make a hell lot of money for sure!:thumb:

Pipshower, "Order flow" is an interesting topic.There are some suggestions on that:

1. We can open a new topic for the discussion.

2. To use order flow you need to have access to bank/ broker order book. And the way I know u get that info is by being hired by them ( talking strictly in sense of Forex, futures order book is open for everyone to see). Even then the order book is representation of their customers and orders, not the whole market. The order info is made of volume with price. With the skepticism abt the reliability of volumes on a single broker existing on this thread it will be difficult to grasp the concept.

3. I am pretty sure you know this but VSA does comes close to order flow. Close enough but not the same.

Gud luck with the new thread (if you do decide to open one) :thumb: