Scalping NSE F&O difficult ?

[jagankris]

1) I am 30 years old

2) I have done 10-15 trades a day, but not 200 trades as yet. So want to know if its possible at all with options before I try on those lines

Not that 200 trades a day is impossible.
But one requires very deep pockets and high tech market making algo's to do that.

200 Trades Not possible humanly.

Nifty options are more liquid than BNF check the volume of option trades in Nifty options chains page - NSE.

With 1M charts max no of trades - 30.
Even with 15Seconds charts one may not get more than 40 - 50 trades a day.

If one is able to be focused and execute 10 - 15 trades in options successfully means lot of money.

 

[gunsho]

My goal is to make small amounts in multiple trades and not be exposed to any market risk. I did not find anyone scalping in options so I asked if its possible

There might be many who does scalping in options, bcoz cost is low and 5 trades a day is not going to cost much if you earn 10-15 points at EOD. But still 200 trades is not required at all..

Plz define the small amount for yourself . As it has to be above the cost.

 

[gunsho]

Why do you say scalping is not possible in options but may be in nifty futures?

May be he meant due to the volume.

But scalping in futures, one has to be careful. Even with 10 trades a day, you need to earn 20 points atleast to make it breakeven day. As far as I am aware, 1.5 is the cost for roundtrip in zerodha. With slippage practically, 2 points we can consider as cost for roundtrip. It is a clear NO to have 200 trades in futures.

In this thread, there are discussions about whether 200 trades are possible. But why do you need 200 trades? What is that we are going to achieve? Suppose you have found some system, that throws in 200 trades in a day, can't you have the same strike rate in 10 trades on a higher timeframe? Making 200 points in 200 trades is still loss. Making 50 points in 10 trades is win. As a trader, our aim should be to make money, not nifty points .

As some one pointed early, I agree that, if we can't make money by taking 10-15 trades in a day, 99% we will not make money in the rest of ~180 trades.

 

[new2trade]

Not that 200 trades a day is impossible.
But one requires very deep pockets and high tech market making algo's to do that.

200 Trades Not possible humanly.

Nifty options are more liquid than BNF check the volume of option trades in Nifty options chains page - NSE.

With 1M charts max no of trades - 30.
Even with 15Seconds charts one may not get more than 40 - 50 trades a day.

If one is able to be focused and execute 10 - 15 trades in options successfully means lot of money.

I agree with what you say.

 

[TraderRavi]

Why do you say scalping is not possible in options but may be in nifty futures?

I am unable to explain it but may be options pricing depends on so many things that could be the reason. anyway IMO 200 trades per day type scalping is best suited for equities not FNO.

 

[Giraffe]

Hmmmmm........200 trades.
What tools you plan to use? Charts or Order Flow?
Not sure if anyone can make it on such small timescales without using order flow.

Equileveraged, Nifty Options would be a much cheaper to trade, especially if trading multiple lots. But on the other hand, the pricing of options is much complicated and it gets funnier as the expiry approches. However, IMHO its not going to matter much on such small timeframes.

Banknifty futures are usually more volatile (esp. when banknifty is leading or lagging nifty by signifcant difference) and usually more spread due to low volume. So might be better candidates for scalping. But then again, its like a sharpened katana.....If you get it wrong, it would be BNF scalping you instead of you scalping BNF.

For scalping so much, probably one needs to expand to equities futures also. It would be much better and profitable. But then again, we would need a pretty good scanner for it. You can easily hit double century if foraying in equities futures.

Most importantly, its not good to chase 200/ day targets. It may not be possible on all days. If there is a trade meeting your criteria, hit it, else not. There isn't any man of the match prize for hitting double century....:lol: Don't think you are going to get Bharat Ratna for maximum number of double ton trades in a day......

 

[Giraffe]

I am unable to explain it but may be options pricing depends on so many things that could be the reason. anyway IMO 200 trades per day type scalping is best suited for equities not FNO.

:thumb::thumb:
Yup, being confined to one or two intruments won't present good enough number of opportunities in a day. But 150 scrips would definately do if one can scan for them in realtime

 

[Giraffe]

May be he meant due to the volume.

But scalping in futures, one has to be careful. Even with 10 trades a day, you need to earn 20 points atleast to make it breakeven day. As far as I am aware, 1.5 is the cost for roundtrip in zerodha. With slippage practically, 2 points we can consider as cost for roundtrip. It is a clear NO to have 200 trades in futures.

In this thread, there are discussions about whether 200 trades are possible. But why do you need 200 trades? What is that we are going to achieve? Suppose you have found some system, that throws in 200 trades in a day, can't you have the same strike rate in 10 trades on a higher timeframe? Making 200 points in 200 trades is still loss. Making 50 points in 10 trades is win. As a trader, our aim should be to make money, not nifty points .

As some one pointed early, I agree that, if we can't make money by taking 10-15 trades in a day, 99% we will not make money in the rest of ~180 trades.

Maybe this trophy from the brokerage:

(just a little fun, no intention of offending the thread starter)

 

[mastermind007]

My goal is to make small amounts in multiple trades and not be exposed to any market risk. I did not find anyone scalping in options so I asked if its possible

Do you plan to do it manually or use automation?....

If its latter, kindly PM me

 

[new2trade]

Hmmmmm........200 trades.
What tools you plan to use? Charts or Order Flow?
Not sure if anyone can make it on such small timescales without using order flow.

Equileveraged, Nifty Options would be a much cheaper to trade, especially if trading multiple lots. But on the other hand, the pricing of options is much complicated and it gets funnier as the expiry approches. However, IMHO its not going to matter much on such small timeframes.

Banknifty futures are usually more volatile (esp. when banknifty is leading or lagging nifty by signifcant difference) and usually more spread due to low volume. So might be better candidates for scalping. But then again, its like a sharpened katana.....If you get it wrong, it would be BNF scalping you instead of you scalping BNF.

For scalping so much, probably one needs to expand to equities futures also. It would be much better and profitable. But then again, we would need a pretty good scanner for it. You can easily hit double century if foraying in equities futures.

Most importantly, its not good to chase 200/ day targets. It may not be possible on all days. If there is a trade meeting your criteria, hit it, else not. There isn't any man of the match prize for hitting double century....:lol: Don't think you are going to get Bharat Ratna for maximum number of double ton trades in a day......

Time frame would be 1 min or 5 mins.
I would like to do scalping manually to start with. I'm not so sure whether scalping with automation really does work ? How can an automated trading system work better than the human brain ?

200 trades is just a ball-park figure, if more can be done i would like that too. I have done 10-15 trades a day so want to try 200 or more if its possible. Since Nifty and Banknifty are pretty liquid i thought they were pretty good scalping candidates ? Not interested for Bharat Ratna in trading but scalping seems good with zero market risk in any direction?