Zerodha....

[ltnikhil]

HI Zerodha
made my first trade with zerodha today. placed a sell order for nifty index options using nowonline. couple of queries
firstly how to square off positions on nowonline web version.
secondly will we pay rs 20 per square off also.
thirdly if instead of squaring off i place a buy order for equal qty will it be same as square off.
fourthly if we place basket order for four different strike prices will we pay rs 20 or rs 80/-.
fifthly how to place after market basket order using nowonline web version.
thanks.

 

[youngindian]

The thing about BTST which a lot of brokers don't tell you......

There is no risk in selling stocks you own, but you don't own it till you get it in your demat account. Settlement cycle is T+2, if you buy a stock for delivery on monday you will get it into demat only on wednesday evening...

Let me try explaining with an example:

You buy 100 shares of reliance on Monday, on Tuesday these are called as T1 holding(some people call it BTST or ATST positions). T1 holding file is visible on the NOW terminal. The 100 shares of reliance comes to your demat only on Wednesday evening.

Assume you sold the shares on Tuesday as a BTST trade...

Wednesday evening you are supposed to get the 100 reliance to your demat account, assume the counterparty defaulted and you don't get the 100 shares of reliance. Why will the counterparty default?? Assume this guy who sold you this 100 shares was an intraday trader and he forgot to cover his positions. He has to deliver the shares to you, but he has no shares and hence you don't get the shares... The person who has defaulted is taken to auction where he pays a penalty and you will get this auction benefit which is not fixed(can range from 3to 10% of the stock price based on liquidity in auction market)...

Thursday, The shares you sold on tuesday has to be delivered on Thursday, But you don't have the 100 shares to deliver because the person who was to deliver it to you on wednesday defaulted.... On thursday you become a defaulter and you are taken to the auction market...

Between the wednesday's auction market and thursday's auction market is what can cause the problem...Usually the problem doesn't occur, but you might be the 1 in 500 clients who have gotten hurt bad because of this...No broker will take this loss on his head if there is one... If an RM has told you there is no risk of doing a BTST trade, he is wrong... BTST trade has a risk component, a very low risk with liquid A group stocks, but there is... As the quality and liquidity of stock worsens the auction risk keeps going up...

As far as pledging of shares for f&o margin is concerned, we are putting up an automated system similar to that of a motilal....

Hope this helps...


Cheers...

If ever i own a brokerage house, i would be ready to pay whatever you demand to get you into my org. Zerodha should definitely be lucky to have you :thumb:

 

[rajeabc]

The thing about BTST which a lot of brokers don't tell you......

There is no risk in selling stocks you own, but you don't own it till you get it in your demat account. Settlement cycle is T+2, if you buy a stock for delivery on monday you will get it into demat only on wednesday evening...

Let me try explaining with an example:

You buy 100 shares of reliance on Monday, on Tuesday these are called as T1 holding(some people call it BTST or ATST positions). T1 holding file is visible on the NOW terminal. The 100 shares of reliance comes to your demat only on Wednesday evening.

Assume you sold the shares on Tuesday as a BTST trade...

Wednesday evening you are supposed to get the 100 reliance to your demat account, assume the counterparty defaulted and you don't get the 100 shares of reliance. Why will the counterparty default?? Assume this guy who sold you this 100 shares was an intraday trader and he forgot to cover his positions. He has to deliver the shares to you, but he has no shares and hence you don't get the shares... The person who has defaulted is taken to auction where he pays a penalty and you will get this auction benefit which is not fixed(can range from 3to 10% of the stock price based on liquidity in auction market)...

Thursday, The shares you sold on tuesday has to be delivered on Thursday, But you don't have the 100 shares to deliver because the person who was to deliver it to you on wednesday defaulted.... On thursday you become a defaulter and you are taken to the auction market...

Between the wednesday's auction market and thursday's auction market is what can cause the problem...Usually the problem doesn't occur, but you might be the 1 in 500 clients who have gotten hurt bad because of this...No broker will take this loss on his head if there is one... If an RM has told you there is no risk of doing a BTST trade, he is wrong... BTST trade has a risk component, a very low risk with liquid A group stocks, but there is... As the quality and liquidity of stock worsens the auction risk keeps going up...

As far as pledging of shares for f&o margin is concerned, we are putting up an automated system similar to that of a motilal....

Hope this helps...


Cheers...

Risk is associated with market itself. According to you logical risk people should not be trading or investing at all.
I have traded atleast 1000 (over few years and in more than on scripts) BTST with ICICIDIRECT(off high brokerage ) but never faced any such problem.
If you don't have system or facility say I don't have rather beating around the bushes...
You have advantage of low brokerage and people may scarify few facilities. BUT we would love to have all and good facility and options.

 

[rajeabc]

For stop loss, put a sell order @5650 with a trigger price of 5650. That would work.

I faced the same issue. But as Sachin said, to square off at your desired price, just create a sell limit order at the price you want to sell...

I hope NSE Now software gets better in times to come...

Cheers!

I guess then brokerage charge will increase also one need more margin to sell options.

 

[Raju]

Sachin ,

Stop Loss BankNifty - Query

Today I bought BANKNIFTY11JANFUT 1 Lot @10606.50 and immediately had given Stop Loss Order for it @10596
For stop loss I had selected

1. Exhg-Seg - NFO
2. Order Type - SL
3. Qty - 25
4. Price - 12596
5. Tr.Price - 12596
6. Prod Type NRML

The SL did not get executed even though the price went down.In what cases would such a thing happen ?

Do i have to give some range like 12596-12597 ?

I had to give Market order to cover loss.

Please guide , Do I have to put MIS for futures also ?

Raju

 

[Zerodha]

hi you didnt reply to my mail. please tell me when this ilfs proceedings will be over and when i will be able to start trading. please quicken proceedings cause i am really excited start trading.

Will follow up today... CHeers...

 

[Zerodha]

HI Zerodha
made my first trade with zerodha today. placed a sell order for nifty index options using nowonline. couple of queries
firstly how to square off positions on nowonline web version.
secondly will we pay rs 20 per square off also.
thirdly if instead of squaring off i place a buy order for equal qty will it be same as square off.
fourthly if we place basket order for four different strike prices will we pay rs 20 or rs 80/-.
fifthly how to place after market basket order using nowonline web version.
thanks.

Hi Nikhil,

1. On web version, There is no square off link... You would have to take an opposite position in the same scrip to exit it..
2. 20 Rs per executed order... So if you square off it is a different order and yes 20 rs for squaring off..
3. Yes, on the web version this is how you square off... ON the software version there is a square off button..
4. It is 20 Rs per executed order, if you are placing orders through basket, each of the order will have different order numbers.. Yes you will pay Rs 80 if your basket has 4 different orders..
5. Place it like a normal market order, after 6pm it is considered as an after market order...

Best of luck with trading...

 

[nileshkrishna]

I need a few clarifications.
1) Can I buy/sell Z category or t2t Stocks?
2) If i sell some stocks will i get instant credit with which i can buy other stocks?

 

[Zerodha]

Risk is associated with market itself. According to you logical risk people should not be trading or investing at all.
I have traded atleast 1000 (over few years and in more than on scripts) BTST with ICICIDIRECT(off high brokerage ) but never faced any such problem.
If you don't have system or facility say I don't have rather beating around the bushes...
You have advantage of low brokerage and people may scarify few facilities. BUT we would love to have all and good facility and options.

This is how BTST works...We didn't say that there is no BTST, we are offering this to the clients, we are actually offering this to stocks that are not even on the BTST list on icici direct...I just tried to explain how this works, no beating around the bushes...
Ignorance is a bliss-Not knowing something is often more comfortable than knowing it... Just because you haven't faced any issue in the 1000 BTST trades that you have done, doesn't mean it never happens...Market risk is different and you can't put the BTST risk and market risk on the same pedestal... .

Cheers..

 

[Zerodha]

Sachin ,

Stop Loss BankNifty - Query

Today I bought BANKNIFTY11JANFUT 1 Lot @10606.50 and immediately had given Stop Loss Order for it @10596
For stop loss I had selected

1. Exhg-Seg - NFO
2. Order Type - SL
3. Qty - 25
4. Price - 12596
5. Tr.Price - 12596
6. Prod Type NRML

The SL did not get executed even though the price went down.In what cases would such a thing happen ?

Do i have to give some range like 12596-12597 ?

I had to give Market order to cover loss.

Please guide , Do I have to put MIS for futures also ?

Raju

Hi,

Typically, stop loss for a long position especially on a contract which is such high value( i mean bank nifty is 12600) don't keep the trigger price and the limit price at the same price...When market is going down, your trigger will activate the order at 12596 but if bank nifty goes down after your trigger is hit your stop loss becomes a pending limit order at 12596...

The idea is to keep the trigger price always> limit price for stop loss sells and trigger price < limit price for stop loss buys...

For your eg, ideally you should have put a trigger price at 12597 and limit as 12596, so when the trigger is hit at 12597, the limit order hits the system and gets executed at 12596.....

But does this guarantee an execution?? NO..
1. Assume from 12600 market fell 30 points in one tick and your trigger never got it... Ideally keep your trigger price at whole numbers, the chances of execution of your stop is much higher keeping the trigger at 12600 rather than 12597...
2. Your trigger is hit, but market is in a free fall and your sell becomes pending.. When placing a Stop loss, if you mention the limit price as 0, then when the trigger is hit, the stop loss becomes a market order...

Again for both the examples, 99% of the time you will not face any issue with stop loss orders... the 1% of the time when market cracks is what you need to be ready for...

Cheers...