Going With The 60min Flow!!!

[Saint]

I have no idea where exactly to start this post..........The no of emails,pms and posts on this thread since yesterday was overwhelming.I did not expect such a strong outpouring of emotions.......I feel I have inadvertently hurt many by the post yesterday....That definitely was not my intention.

Most posters on this thread and maybe most people in this forum already know most of what I am about to mention.........but to those who are new and reading through this thread,a few pointers:

a.I do not believe there is a Holy Grail in trading.....I do not believe that one shoe fits all.....I believe that there are many paths to the same destination,probably as many paths as there are individuals.........Therefore what is discussed here is just something that has worked for me.Some of you with a similar mindset could walk it the same way.Others may tweak it a bit.And yet others would probably add an indicator or something else if that be their comfort zone.And then there are others who find this "full of crap".

----To those who want any help,feel free to ask.To those who think this is a total waste of time,move on to other threads..........There are so many out there,take your pick,if none,feel free to start a thread and carry on the discussions.

-----One more point,shun anyone....I mean anyone....who tells you that his way is the only way.In Life and in Trading.Be it junior or senior member.Be it even any of the most respected senior members.If he tells you that everything is hogwash,and he has hit upon the path...THE PATH....shun him because he is giving you rotten advice.......If you found a way to trade using Donchian channels or Bollinger bands,and you are making tonnes,your way is great for YOU.......Never,ever listen to someone who tells you otherwise,however well meaning he may sound,however great at testing strategies he is,however senior he is................Remember:There is no one absolute way to Trading Mastery.Shun anyone who tells you otherwise.

b.There are many amongst us who share what they know.....Great. Many who share a bit of what they know.....Great.Many who don't share anything at all.....Great as well.

Your call to take.......But let not the third category above make it sound like they are professional traders with the greatest of secrets,cards held close to their chests,all hush-hush lest anyone figure out their treasured system.

----Share if you want,but do not put down the guy who shares a bit or nothing at all.Don't share if you don't want,but don't make it look like that is the only way to do things,and the guy who does is a madman.

----An add from my end:I have done nothing but shout from every rooftop all that I know........and the more I share,the better I become.I have been told that once everyone figures out this method,then it isn't going to work anymore.....Well,I shared anyway.It still works for me....and getting better by the day.Lessonlease don't think you are bigger than the market.Pivots existed from Day 1 of markets in history.Sharing it isn't going to change that.
My take:Go out of your way to help.....share all that you know.....help anyone and everyone....Infect the world by your Passion....And as you share,more and more,you are not losing a part of you.Instead,you are discovering new areas of you that you never knew existed.You become a much bigger individual.......

More in the next.

Saint

 

[trader111]

No one comes close in wisdom, just no one!

I have no idea where exactly to start this post..........The no of emails,pms and posts on this thread since yesterday was overwhelming.I did not expect such a strong outpouring of emotions.......I feel I have inadvertently hurt many by the post yesterday....That definitely was not my intention.

Most posters on this thread and maybe most people in this forum already know most of what I am about to mention.........but to those who are new and reading through this thread,a few pointers:
a.I do not believe there is a Holy Grail in trading.....I do not believe that one shoe fits all.....I believe that there are many paths to the same destination,probably as many paths as there are individuals.........Therefore what is discussed here is just something that has worked for me.Some of you with a similar mindset could walk it the same way.Others may tweak it a bit.And yet others would probably add an indicator or something else if that be their comfort zone.And then there are others who find this "full of crap".

----To those who want any help,feel free to ask.To those who think this is a total waste of time,move on to other threads..........There are so many out there,take your pick,if none,feel free to start a thread and carry on the discussions.


-----One more point,shun anyone....I mean anyone....who tells you that his way is the only way.In Life and in Trading.Be it junior or senior member.Be it even any of the most respected senior members.If he tells you that everything is hogwash,and he has hit upon the path...THE PATH....shun him because he is giving you rotten advice.......If you found a way to trade using Donchian channels or Bollinger bands,and you are making tonnes,your way is great for YOU.......Never,ever listen to someone who tells you otherwise,however well meaning he may sound,however great at testing strategies he is,however senior he is................Remember:There is no one absolute way to Trading Mastery.Shun anyone who tells you otherwise.

b.There are many amongst us who share what they know.....Great. Many who share a bit of what they know.....Great.Many who don't share anything at all.....Great as well.

Your call to take.......But let not the third category above make it sound like they are professional traders with the greatest of secrets,cards held close to their chests,all hush-hush lest anyone figure out their treasured system.

----Share if you want,but do not put down the guy who shares a bit or nothing at all.Don't share if you don't want,but don't make it look like that is the only way to do things,and the guy who does is a madman.

----An add from my end:I have done nothing but shout from every rooftop all that I know........and the more I share,the better I become.I have been told that once everyone figures out this method,then it isn't going to work anymore.....Well,I shared anyway.It still works for me....and getting better by the day.Lessonlease don't think you are bigger than the market.Pivots existed from Day 1 of markets in history.Sharing it isn't going to change that.
My take:Go out of your way to help.....share all that you know.....help anyone and everyone....Infect the world by your Passion....And as you share,more and more,you are not losing a part of you.Instead,you are discovering new areas of you that you never knew existed.You become a much bigger individual.......

More in the next.

Saint

 

[rkripal]

hello saint,

thanks for the post, almost all of ur posts are great and so is this one.
when the words come from heart, it touches the hearts and souls of others.
your words of wisdom were/are/and will always be great my friend.

and yes, knowledge is multiplied by sharing it.
thank you very much

rkripal

 

[Saint]

The 60min Trend Trade::Very simple........we trade the 60min chart only.No perspective charts here.No looking at trends on higher time frames.We buy previous pivot highs on the 60,we hold,and we exit once previous pivot lows are broken,and we go short,We hold,and then cover and go long once previous pivot highs are taken out.It's an always-in-the-trade type of trade.............There is no analysis here,no thinking,just going with the flow up and down.......the only work done is position sizing,maybe adding to positions,one keeps one's mind away from opinionating about the larger time frames........One just doesn't care anymore.A larger time frame crash will involve you into it,a euphoric rise up will have you in it,the frustrating sideways will probably get you in and out a few times but would be reduced if stops are placed in the right zones.........

As said before,one therefore just goes with the Flow...........things are kept very simple.I go long because the previous 60min pivot high is taken out,I exit and go short because the previous pivot lows are taken out,and vice versa.

Trade Smaller and Longer is the way out here.........I have a stop at previous pivot lows and stop is Rs60 away......I do my Position Sizing,and Rs12k is the risk I am prepared to take,therefore I buy 200,or 4NF lots.However juicy and yummy that pattern may be,I am getting in with 4 lots because my Trading Plan says so.

Add's as always at newer pivot highs with stops raised to latest pivot lows.....think it's a bit boring to repeat all of this......

To reiterate once more:

TIME FRAME:60MIN

PERSPECTIVE CHART:None

ENTRY:When the latest pivot high is taken out,enter long.When the latest pivot low is taken out,enter short.

EXIT:If initial stop is taken out.........If previous pivot lows in an uptrend are taken out,exit longs and go short.If previous pivot highs are taken out in a dntrend,exit shorts and go long.

When charts get vertical,steep-ish gradient,put stops at previous 2 bar low,exit long and go short if triggerred..........No steep gradient,no using this method,then it's pivots all the way.

ADD:Add to longs only if newer pivot highs are made in an uptrend.....Add to shorts only when newer pivot lows are made in a downtrend.Every down/up bar is also an opportunity to add.This depends on the chart and the way it makes its moves.For example:ABAN is an example of a chart where each up or down bar is an opportunity to add.

PROFIT TAKING:NONE......no profit taking as far as I am concerned.But do take profits off the table if you can't sleep nights and picking on your wife..........Profits therefore only for preservation of sanity.

POSITION SIZING:Very simplistic and rudimentary form,but it still has kept me out of harm's way..........already discussed in the "Teach a Man to...."thread.Entry is at point x........Stops are 60 points off.I take my capital,and risk only 0.5% of it ,say it's 12k.........divide 12k by 60 NF pts,you get 200 shares,or 4 nf lots.Therefore whatever happens,go long with 4 lots only.

One more add:Say we entered with 4 NF lots long,and added another 6 along the way,all the while raising stops,we hold all 10,we get pivots taken out or 2 bar rule in a vertical move violated,then calculate from that pivot high to entry point(for ease of calculations,presuming it's 60pts away,therefore you need to short 4 lots).........so we sell 14 lots,therefore exitting all 10 longs and entering 4 shorts......Apologies for multiple reiterations.

MINDSET:A mind that is simple........devoid of too many if's and but's and why's and why not's......a mind that refuses to get swayed by larger time frames,CNBC,other traders,gossip,rumours,etc............a mind that dares to stick to strategy and plan and in doing so stays in the present and is not swayed by a euphoric rise or a precipitous fall,thereby leaping over the Fear-Greed Barrier..........A mind that stays in the Now,removing the "I" from the trade........A mind that goes with the Flow......in this case the 60min Flow.

All the best!
Saint

 

[aad]

Happy to see you back Saint.

Warm regards,

Abhay

 

[Saint]

There is so much profits to be pulled out of a 60min move in a stock like LITL........clear cut pivots et al.Not really interested in holding NF overnight and sufferring gaps up and down.Basically trade NF using smaller time frames.......think I have said this somewhere already.

Saint

 

[milkyblack]

Saint,

You are a human being like any other human being.... who wants to survive 1st... do things for his/her own first... doing things for others becomes a bit difficult sometimes....

But then also being a human being how is that you have shared everything on this public forum? How? Did you not find it difficult to share knowledge with OTHERS?

No Saint you never found it difficult to share knowledge with OTHERS as by the name you posses "SAINT".... for a Saint the identity is not only him/her but the whole world is his/her... when other gets hurt... Saint feels the pain... and Saint want the benefit of all ... all around him/her...

You have lived up to the true meaning of SAINT....

Hats off to you!

Thanks a lot for having such wonderful thoughts which you implement day after day!

Thanks for posting back again to this forum

Best Regards

 

[milkyblack]

There is so much profits to be pulled out of a 60min move in a stock like LITL........clear cut pivots et al.Not really interested in holding NF overnight and sufferring gaps up and down.Basically trade NF using smaller time frames.......think I have said this somewhere already.

Saint

Yes Saint you have kept on mentioning this again and again... but I did the mistake of putting trades based on 60 min....
My apologies!

Regards

 

[Saint]

Basically the 60min Flow trade is supposed to be as little "YOU" as possible..........so we zoom out the charts,and change direction only when something clear cut happens.

VISUAL GAP:What is this nonsense?A gap is a gap is a gap.......Yes,again,my way of telling: Don't micro manage.Don't try to measure the gap...2% or 5%(we believe in exacts,Saint......by visual,you mean 2% or 1%....no ,no,go by the eye,I say.......aw c'mon,Saint...too vague,subjective.....we believe in precision,backtesting,mechanising,etc.......you believe in the EYE ???!!!)

A visual gap is a gap that is obvious on the 60min chart,either by zooming out the chart or by visualisng it across the room.....Apologies for this in the present technofancy world we live in......I believe in the magic of trading,the art,the beauty.....not the dry scientific putting in numbers,and getting some lines and arrows......and Buy/Sell signals.

Thought it best to define me.....so that the next time,someone asks me about the science,.....the dry arid logic,.............cold,hard,facts.....the response would be zilch.Apologies in advance.

Back to topic.......a visual gap is that gap that is obvious to the naked eye from across the room.

Gaps in the direction of the preexisting trend

1.We are long a trade,day 1,2,3,4.......big moves on the 60......trade gets vertical.....wrb's one after another....market shuts and opens with a big visual gap up.Allow the 1st bar to form,put your stop below that bar (with a bit extra) and reverse to short when triggerred.

2.Same as 1 for shorts.

3.All other gaps in the direction of the trend......nothing to be done.Once the day progresses and pivots form,the latest pivot low can become the new recent stop and reverse point.

So long as gaps are in the direction of the trend.........nothing except in case 1 to be done about it.Treat it as if it were a strong move up if that makes you feel better.But when the NIFTY gaps up 150pts,we ache to put that 50-60k in the pocket.And then we mess it up trying to get in lower and give back half or more.Stick to the plan........We want as much of the meat as possible out of that trend move.And in that,we are willing to leave a lot on the table.

The question you have to ask is:Can you do it?Do you have the stomach and capital and mental fortitude to pull it off?If the answer is yes,.....great.If the answer is no,.....are you sure that the method is faulty.Or is the fault in the organ between the two ears?

More in the next.

Saint

 

[Saint]

Gaps in the reverse direction of the preexisting trend

Long tradereexisting trend is up....Visual gap down.Is it below the previous pivot low on the 60?If yes,short the low of the first bar.If no,hold and see if pivots crack.Exit longs and go short.

Vice versa for short trades.

Broadly.....always a hundred different possibilities,but broadly.


Saint