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Clarifications about the 60 day challenge.

Zerodha,

Just asking for clarifications for the record :

About the 60 day challenge :

1. For the exchanges / segments covered under your scheme, trades in the index futures and options are also included ?

2. Suppose I suffer a net loss in intraday equities (x) and make a profit in options (y), these will not be considered separately ?? You will only check whether x+y > 0, ??

Thanks.
 
Hi Zerodha,

When it comes to investments in Equities , ppl may invest on recommendations of friends/relatives/professionals/TV experts.....so and so.

When it comes to trading, that too intraday/swing, there will be hardly few who don't see charts and do trades as per recommendations of others.

Now for EOD charts, theres already lot of sources available and needless to mention.....free.

For Intraday charts : Either traders pay for Java based charts OR take aid of ODIN charts OR use Amibroker/MS/etc etc with paid data feeds.
Out of them we have good indicator collection (ie. AFL ) for Amibroker for which many provide datafeeds for as low as 500pm.

But Metatrader4 which has large number of free trading systems/indicator and which is very user friendly. Curr very few foreign brokers provide charting/trading thru MT4.They have large number of Demo a/c.But they do not score the same number for real a/c as ppl do not incline to open 'REAL account due to various reasons ( like reliability concern, brokerage etc etc ). I don't think any INdian broker provide MT4 for obvious reasons.If i am not wrong, then u have to lease MT4 server or something like that stuff.

There are Lot of traders who apply their MT4 systems on Demo MT4 which have limited symbols ( that too with price mismatch with indian exchanges), just to analyse and subsequently trade.

Since Zerodha is volume topper in India. It can consider providing MT4. Afteralll ,'Economies of Scale ' matter a LOT. Zerodha surely can have first mover advantage.

Traders will not mind even if Zerodha put some minimum brokerage condition for it.
( Pls Note- I am not aware of server lease or required procedure , but i read somewhere it's something like that in TJ's thread named 'Free MT4 data...'.)

Hope u will do SWOT analysis and feasibility study of above concept.


Regards
Meena
 
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Re: Clarifications about the 60 day challenge.

Zerodha,

Just asking for clarifications for the record :

About the 60 day challenge :

1. For the exchanges / segments covered under your scheme, trades in the index futures and options are also included ?

2. Suppose I suffer a net loss in intraday equities (x) and make a profit in options (y), these will not be considered separately ?? You will only check whether x+y > 0, ??

Thanks.
As per my understanding, index futures is included.Premiums received by selling of options are not inlcuded but profits on all closed options positions will be included ( Zerodha needs to clarify on this options point )

Equities and FO are considered as separate segments....each qualify for Zerodha challenge separately.So profits and losses in equities and FO cannot be clubbed to get net profit/loss. One has to be profitable in that segment separately. So if you have a loss in equities and profits in FO....your equities brokerage will not be refunded but you are entitled for refund of brokerage paid in FO segment.

Good incentive for traders to remain profitable and in the process they will start following good trading practices.

Smart_trade
 
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Hi Zerodha/ seniors

If i buy 2 Nifty Fut lots, then i will be charged buy side brok of 20 (+taxes+levies).

Now, if i sell one lot at 15 point and second at 30 point in 2 separate orders, sell side brok will be 20+20 .......ok

Now suppose : 2 scenarios of same order :
1. After buying 2lots, if i place a single order to sell one lot @15 and another and 30, and both order get executed at respective prices, then brok will be 20 or 40 ?


2. Now, i bought 2NF and placed a single order to sell 1lot@15 and second@30. First sell executed and for second lot , down the line seeing charts, i decided to sell second lot @20.Hence i modified order and sold second lot. Now on sell side, i will be charged 20 or (20+20) ?


thanks
Meena
Can you put such orders which are single limit orders to be executed at two different prices ? I don't think so ...These are two different orders with different order numbers.

Smart_trade
 
Thanks. What is the difference GOLD and Goldpital, etc

How can we take advantage of Low Brokerage in Trading, I think we have to choose Low voltile, high volume Commodity for Trade so we can book profit and avoid big lose
Lot size. Gold is a 1000 gm contract and gold petal is a 8 gm contract IIRC. GoldM is a 100 gm contact.
 

augubhai

Well-Known Member
Lot size. Gold is a 1000 gm contract and gold petal is a 8 gm contract IIRC. GoldM is a 100 gm contact.
GOLD = 1000 grams (1 KG)
GOLDM = 100 grams
GOLDGUINEA = 8 grams
GOLDPETAL = 1 gram

The price of GOLD and GOLDM are quoted in Rs. per 10 grams. The price of GOLDGUINEA is quoted in Rs. per 8 grams. The price of GOLDPETAL is quoted in Rs. per 1 gram.
 
Hi Zerodha,

When it comes to investments in Equities , ppl may invest on recommendations of friends/relatives/professionals/TV experts.....so and so.

When it comes to trading, that too intraday/swing, there will be hardly few who don't see charts and do trades as per recommendations of others.

Now for EOD charts, theres already lot of sources available and needless to mention.....free.

For Intraday charts : Either traders pay for Java based charts OR take aid of ODIN charts OR use Amibroker/MS/etc etc with paid data feeds.
Out of them we have good indicator collection (ie. AFL ) for Amibroker for which many provide datafeeds for as low as 500pm.

But Metatrader4 which has large number of free trading systems/indicator and which is very user friendly. Curr very few foreign brokers provide charting/trading thru MT4.They have large number of Demo a/c.But they do not score the same number for real a/c as ppl do not incline to open 'REAL account due to various reasons ( like reliability concern, brokerage etc etc ). I don't think any INdian broker provide MT4 for obvious reasons.If i am not wrong, then u have to lease MT4 server or something like that stuff.

There are Lot of traders who apply their MT4 systems on Demo MT4 which have limited symbols ( that too with price mismatch with indian exchanges), just to analyse and subsequently trade.

Since Zerodha is volume topper in India. It can consider providing MT4. Afteralll ,'Economies of Scale ' matter a LOT. Zerodha surely can have first mover advantage.

Traders will not mind even if Zerodha put some minimum brokerage condition for it.
( Pls Note- I am not aware of server lease or required procedure , but i read somewhere it's something like that in TJ's thread named 'Free MT4 data...'.)

Hope u will do SWOT analysis and feasibility study of above concept.


Regards
Meena
I totally agree with you. But AFAIK, MT4, by Metaquotes is given to only Forex brokers. And so, I don't think MT4 is used by any stock brokers around the world. But, yes a platform like MT4 is what our markets need and we will be getting there, how soon or late I am not sure, as I have been waiting for one good platform which gives tools for trading and with ease. Some of the platforms that you mentioned like charting on ODIN and yeah I have seen KeatproX's charts, they provide 3D charting (I expect better features than the 3D candles), I really don't care about it, coz the 3rd Dimension doesn't give me any picture or depth of sentiment, rather eats up my PC's resources, also the servers hosted on ports which everyone can't connect, I have seen couple of data vendors for charting also do that, to whom I had to call and tell, hiding is not the solution for security, it doesn't take more than few seconds to find out what port you are using, and should use better ways to secure themselves. Even coming to pure paid technical analysis software developed here for our markets, like IRIS or Falcon, they have some of the features which are very good, but they lack in others a lot compared to Esignal, Ami/Metastock, I don't know when they will get there, also pricing wise they are now quite comparable to Esignal, so they have to excel in adding features, else people here would go to Esignal than IRIS/Falcon. I hope our brokers/software/data vendors understand the features that really matters and important, how its there in Amibroker, or MT4 (they are not trading terminals, but just taking examples, how a software should be), simple, precise and fast and importantly which are needed, what really matters and used.

One more important thing is we will never get best of two things in one, very good trading platform as well as very good technical analysis platform in one and by your broker itself. Coz, they are two different markets, addressed by two different entities. Still, there are great platforms which has decent features from both worlds for trading and technical analysis for traders, like Lightspeed trader, DAS trader Pro, Thinkorswim, interactive brokers's, like other day I was mentioning tradeinterceptor even on mobile there are great tools. I hope the vendors here, look to get some features and/or match in the future. Also, how much I wish some of the things which is considered as Algo trading is also waived off too for us.

We just saw a first wave of change in our markets about 2 years back (you know who brought that first wave, you know who am referring to ;) ), definitely, there will someone who will get the first mover advantage out of it for our markets for this also.

Cheers!
 
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hc9001

Well-Known Member
Re: Opening balence for 60day challenge..

my question too......;)
Balance b4 market opening on 15th feb [same as after market/closing balence of valentines day ;) ] is considered as bench mark for the scheme.
Situation, exactly same as balence taken at the time for toss at 8.55 am of a cricket game which starts at 9:15 am Feb 15th. It is a 60 day test match & no chance of a tie (if u play). :clap:
 
@ST, I asked this because their offer states :
Zerodha 60-day Challenge
6. Both Equity (intraday equity and f&o) and Commodity will be considered as separate individual challenges.
So, I am assuming that the P&L of intraday equity and F&O will be merged, and Commodity will be separate. What about currency F&O ?? Will that be a separate P&L or be merged ??
Why am I asking this ?? Because all these are on the same exchange.

Zerodha 60-day Challenge
Exchanges Applicable: NSE (Equity, F&O, Currency)

MCX (Commodities)
Next, why am I asking about Index futures and options being included ?? Because it's not explicitly mentioned anywhere. Ok, maybe I'm being hair-splitty and that it is understood when they say NSE F&O, but just asking.
c. Repetition : This will be available only for intraday equities, NSE F&O, commodities and currency.
C : Yes you are right...
As per my understanding, index futures is included.Premiums received by selling of options are not inlcuded but profits on all closed options positions will be included ( Zerodha needs to clarify on this options point )

Equities and FO are considered as separate segments....each qualify for Zerodha challenge separately.So profits and losses in equities and FO cannot be clubbed to get net profit/loss. One has to be profitable in that segment separately. So if you have a loss in equities and profits in FO....your equities brokerage will not be refunded but you are entitled for refund of brokerage paid in FO segment.

Good incentive for traders to remain profitable and in the process they will start following good trading practices.

Smart_trade
Zerodha,

Just asking for clarifications for the record :

About the 60 day challenge :

1. For the exchanges / segments covered under your scheme, trades in the index futures and options are also included ?

2. Suppose I suffer a net loss in intraday equities (x) and make a profit in options (y), these will not be considered separately ?? You will only check whether x+y > 0, ??

Thanks.
@Zerodha, Next, will the customers have different closing dates for the scheme ?? You mention that :
The Zerodha 60-day Challenge will start from your first trade on or after February 15, 2012. The contest will run for a total of 60 trading days. If the cash balance in your account on the 60th day is more than what it was on day one, you will get back all the brokerage you paid us during this period.
So, if an existing customer doesn't trade for some time and has his first trade, say, on April 9th, what will be the closing date for him ?
 
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